May 26, 2022
Conversations
Interview & Producer: Zoe Adlersberg
Text: Camille Bavera
This three-hour conversation pairs Ed Templeton veteran skater, street photographer, and jack of all artistic trades, with Manon Macasaet, a fresh-faced multimedia artist, videographer, and voice in the skating community. The pairing here was conscious - Templeton having navigated the world of pro-skating from the start, and Manon, stepping off her board and finding her feet in a male-dominated industry by relying on the guidance of those who came before her. But not too much. Vet meets rookie, each perspective unique and each representing an audience so vastly different from the other, even within such a small community.
MANON: So, Hi. Nice to meet you.
ED: I'm just so interested in your...I don't even how to explain it. You started all this stuff, I read an interview with you where you said you were 16 doing all this stuff, right? [referring to Manon’s series Story of My Fucking Life ]
M: I didn't start the show when I was 16, I actually started it during like the first COVID summer because I was super bored. And I was looking through all of my old footage and videos from parties and stuff and I realized like how special all of it was because I didn't know when I would go to another party. I had a question for you actually. Do you think there was something different about that time that we are missing? And if so, what is it?
ED: Between my youth and your youth?
M: Yeah, between the Big Brother times and now. Because people are so afraid of being canceled and being called out.
ED: A big part of it is that everything gets taken at face value now. I mean, the book I'm working on which - fingers crossed - it's you know, my whole life of documenting skateboarding, finally coming out ten years after I “retired from skating”. And one aspect of it is the toxic masculinity. That's part of it, you know, because being in a van with a bunch of skater kids pre internet, one aspect of it I was documenting was that fame of being a skateboarder - a lot of which could potentially get labeled as canceled nowadays.
M: I think, in a lot of ways, the internet stopped people from being shady and doing bad stuff. But I also think in a lot of ways, it's just made people kind of dishonest. Sometimes it's hard to tell if people are wanting to do the right thing or if they're just afraid of getting caught.
ED: So human nature. If you're just a douchebag and now you're just getting good at cloaking the fact that you're a douchebag, inevitably, it's gonna come out at some point. Is that the point? I mean, the internet and Instagram is a whole thing - it's like everyone's got their own channel. So the idea of a collective doing stuff. Like half the stuff that Big Brother did or any skaters did was because of boredom. Like, what do we do with free time? We're just sitting here. I mean, now it seems like every free moment is filled up with a phone. And so half the shenanigans and stuff that they would do that ended up being funny that barely happens anymore, which is kind of weird. Skaters on tour don't go out and do ridiculous stuff anymore. But that was my generation. Aside from skating, it was just, “How do you deal with boredom?” Yeah, so it was like chasing girls, breaking shit.
“I hate it when people take themselves too seriously”-Ed Templeton
M: Well Big Brother and Jackass, to me, feels like a vehicle for everybody's dreams. It seemed like everybody really wanted to just keep doing like that type of fun shit forever and be taken seriously for it. I feel like that's a lot of what I do too. I have a weird hotdog cart with my friend, which is like such a joke, but we take it super seriously. And this show is a huge joke, but it's really silly and wholesome and fun. But it really is just me trying to actualize my dreams. And I know what you mean about phones and Instagram and people being bored - and just resorting to being on their phones. So I made the show kind of as a response to just being bored during COVID. Also, I was just feeling really bored with all of the content I was seeing. I watched ‘American Club’ and ‘High Octane’ and I was like “wow, this is really cool” because nobody needed to be doing that. They kind of just created their own fun and did all this stuff on their own volition. And I found something about that really beautiful. And I thought, ‘what's stopping me from doing that myself?
You have to kind of be the change you want to see in the world and make your own fun and make things happen. I hate when people take themselves too seriously. I don't know! I feel like lately people are like, super pretentious.
ED: Yeah, getting roasted is like such a big part of skate culture. I'd walk into every room or every tour right off the bat to just be like, ‘Alright, I'm old I'm fat. What are you gonna say to me?’ You know I just like to disarm it. I know all the jokes so let's get it over with.
“They just created their own fun and did all this stuff on their own volition; and I found something about that really beautiful.” - Manon Macasaet
M: Oh, also, um, I was going to just try to surprise you with this, but I'm making a spoof of teenage kissers and teenage smokers called ‘Pisser.’
ED: Oh, nice! Well, I was gonna ask you about that. I saw the section in your latest video with the kissing. It reminds me of the ‘90s and the 2000s that I took part in but there are always going to be examples of people doing similar things. But it's always a fresh take. You know, I took examples from people and did it my own way, the same way you're taking examples from people and doing it your own way.. But that you specifically did the kissing thing because of the book? That's pretty cool.
I mean, kissing to me is the closest we get to sex in public. Most of those photos I took are actually candid - like people didn't know I shot them. Yeah, obviously some of the people, like the back cover, are people I know and then there's those kids on the front cover where it was at a skate demo, so they kind of knew I was there shooting photos of them. Some people I just asked to kiss for me! But really, a lot of those in there are just when I would see someone kissing and just basically walk up and shoot a photo. And I’d say they didn't even notice me ninety percent of the time. I'm sure if I asked half those people, they would have been like, “get the fuck away from me you weirdo.”
M: I wanted them all to be like movie scenes, because I love like a movie kiss. I remembered how I was rewatching ‘Kids’ a while ago with my friend Aiden, and he said that first scene is just so powerful because it's just people kissing and it's so simple, but you love watching it. It's so enticing and amazing. And something Aaron Rose wrote that I reread last night, which kind of shook me, is that we're still never so far from that first kiss. And I was like, that's so true - it's not just kissing, it's like taking a leap of faith.
“We're still never so far from that first kiss”-Manon Macasaet
ED: The other part of what I see you doing that I did with skateboarding and what you saw in ‘Big Brother' was basically the ‘do it yourself’ aspect of it where nobody was going to do anything for us. So everything was like, ‘let's do it ourselves’. So the magazine for instance was just like, these guys did it - we figured out how to work the layout programs and did it ourselves. I designed all my own books. I do all the Toy Machine graphics. And then I didn't even worry about what I would do if Toy Machine went out of business because I can do everything. I can do any design related thing you can ask. I can do photography, I can paint. I will have a job at some point, doing all the things I've learned on my own, things I’ve driven myself to learn. So, if you're shooting, editing, writing scripts, you've got all these skills, and you've done it yourself through trial and error, which is amazing. That's what makes people original. You’re not necessarily getting the template from school on how to do it, but just learning through trial and error. You're making mistakes, you're doing something, and so it sucks if it doesn’t work but then also you want to make it better next time, so you do it again. And that's the kind of stuff that's amazing. I think the downside to doing everything yourself is that you're the only person who you trust to do it. You end up having to do everything yourself, you know, so I don't know how much time you spend editing, but for me it was like ninety percent of the time.
M: It's a lot! The editing is everything. It takes me like a day or sometimes an hour to shoot a segment because my friends are so funny and natural, so it just flows. That's the easy part. But all the pre-production and post-production is where I really start pulling my hair out.
ED: Yeah, that's the unglamorous side of it, you know. The glamorous side is what everyone usually ends up seeing like what we're doing now. This is going to be in a magazine, or if you have an opening and everyone's there talking about you, but yeah, no one sees the countless hours that you spent making all this work. All the time and effort that goes into that, you know, like, I'm sitting here in California, and it's 80 degrees outside. I'm sitting in my garage, hunched over a painting when I could be at the beach enjoying myself. So yeah, like you and I just talked about, no one is making me do any of that stuff - I could even think ‘fuck this painting and fuck this whole show - I'm gonna go live on the beach for the rest of my life’ but instead, something inside makes me want to do this thing.
M: I agree - I wouldn't want to have it any other way, even though it makes me such a psycho sometimes. Because, I don't know, it truly makes me very happy - it's my passion. So I'm sure you feel that because you also seem like a true believer.
“A lot of those (photos) are just when I would see someone kissing and just basically walk up and shoot a photo” - Ed Templeton
ED: I'm looking at you, man, and the baton is passed. Like what you’re saying, it's your generation and it's your responsibility - this is your challenge. Your challenge is to break out and create something completely new.
M: Like I just said, and this is obviously a famous quote, but you really have to be the change you want to see in the world.
ED: Yeah, I don't know what it is. I guess people call it drive, you know, I have some kind of drive to do something. Maybe I'm trying to prove something from some childhood trauma or, who knows, maybe there's some chip on my shoulder that makes me want to do all of that stuff. But what trauma made you into this person?
M: I had a weird existential crisis in high school where I remember just feeling kind of lost and looking around me and thinking so far ahead. For a 15-year-old, I didn’t know what I wanted to be when I grew up yet, and I didn't think anything around me at my school was helping to figure it out. I hated all my classes plus I started to have a weird physical response to school, like psychosomatic symptoms that pertained to each specific class. In my French class, I would get a splitting headache every time that would go away as soon as I walked out of the class. In my English class, I would just dry retch, and couldn't talk. Then I would just also have a weird fever the whole day; I hated being in that place physically and mentally, with every fiber of my being. I remember at 15 just thinking, ‘I don't really know what I want to do.’ And I think that trying to figure that out, and interning places, and trying to figure out what I was passionate about by actually experimenting with it was a huge form of solace for me. It helped me get through anything that was ever bothering me. Whether it was stuff at home, or boys or whatever was bumming me out, it was nice to have an outlet of some sort.
ED: Everyone has the choice. I mean, you choose to be happy or not happy.
M: Speaking of happy, how did you get into painting?
ED: Oh, gosh, I started painting in 1990. I mean those first paintings I did at the beginning are wildly different from what I do now. So much has changed. So for me, this painting show was just another evolution and a step towards, gaining some skill. I want to do what's in my mind's eye, and every time paint hits the canvas, it’s closer to what I imagine than a lot of other times. It's like you have a vision of what you want to do but your hand doesn't work the right way. But you can't necessarily make it and you just kind of settle for what you can do. What I envision and what I produce are different, but they’re getting closer; it's just a lifelong sort of pursuit.
“What I envision and what I produce are different, but they’re getting closer; it's just a lifelong sort of pursuit”-Ed Templeton
M: I mean, it seems really different from your earlier stuff - like painting on like photos, things like that.
ED: I still paint on photos a little bit. I think the big difference for this show is that I've sort of opened the floodgates to using my own photography as the basis for my paintings. I was always resistant to it in the past, where I would kind of hate the idea of someone just painting a photograph, you know, just use the actual photograph instead - don't just copy a photograph. But I realized that I can take bits and pieces of my own photographs and make a composite on the computer for what I want to do. I have these backgrounds that I shoot, I have people that I want to put in these backgrounds, and so then I combine them and make a drawing. Then from the drawing, I start to paint, but the core of it is still my photography. So I think that's what makes it a little more realistic looking.
M: I kind of also feel like art is much more than just the stuff you put out; it's also the person and everything about them. It's like my style is super funky and loud and then my art just translates. It's important to have purpose and like intention; I feel like you're not just making art because you think ‘this looks cool’, you should always have something to say about it.
ED: Exactly, that's kind of what I wanted to do. And as far as today's issues go, it's something to think about. I think everybody's thinking about it. Because if you do just recklessly put something out there without thinking about it, then you are putting yourself at risk of being canceled.
M: I mean, when I look at stuff like Big Brother, I think this can't ever really exist ever again; nobody would dare make this ever again.
ED: Well, I feel like we're keeping you from school.
M: Yeah. Yeah, hopefully meet you soon. I would love to meet you in person.
ED: Yeah, it'd be fun. Well, it'll be awkward. I'm not sure. I'm naturally awkward. You don't seem to be awkward at all.
M: I was a little bit like, I don't know, I haven't like done something like this in a while. So, I was a bit nervous. But then I realized, we're really into similar things. And there's a lot of common ground, so I stopped being nervous within like five minutes.
ED: Right. Thank you. Great speaking with you.
M: Cool beans. You too. Have a nice day.
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